6Mon·

8,000 lesson - How to use the "Other" loss pot without derivatives?

Hello everyone,

I need to get something off my chest today and ask for your advice at the same time. I made the classic mistake at the beginning of 2026: Boredom coupled with FOMO.

The situation: I was on assembly in Mexico. The market was moving sideways, my portfolio was bobbing along and I had too much time in front of the screen. In a knee-jerk reaction, I invested approx. 8,000 € in $TXRH (+1.4%) (which was actually performing solidly) to invest the money in a $META (-0.31%)
leverage certificate (knock-out at 585 $) as the quarterly figures were great and I was speculating on a small rally.

Things looked good at first, but then came Trump's bombshell against Iran in March. As you know, the markets reacted violently, Meta tore my knock-out and the €8,000 virtually vanished into thin air.

The tax problem: I had hoped to be able to offset the loss against my share gains (e.g. from the Texas Roadhouse sale). Now I had to learn the hard way: the certificate ends up in the loss pot "Other"while individual shares end up in the equity pot are isolated.

So now I'm sitting on a big minus in the "Other" pot, while I have dutifully paid withholding tax on my share gains.

My question to you: I have learned my lesson and will keep my hands off derivatives. How can I make the most of the "Other" loss pot over the next few years? without going back to the casino?

As I understand it, the following things work:

Dividends from individual stocks?
Distributions/profits from ETFs?
Interest income (overnight money/bonds)?

Are there any strategies you would use to "passively" reduce such a pot? I don't want to give away unnecessary taxes, but I definitely don't want to make any more revenge trades with leverage. I currently have no ETFs and no real dividend stocks. So I have to actively do something so that I can take advantage of the loss pot.

Thanks for your opinions and thanks for listening - writing this has helped me to process the whole thing a bit.

Greetings Bubu :)

25 Comments

Jürgen S.@Snoopyjs

6Mon

"Profits from the sale of shares (tax pot shares) can be offset against losses from both loss pots." It should therefore at least be possible to reduce the tax burden from the sale of shares. Source: https://marcowenzel.de/wie-funktioniert-die-verrechnung-von-verlusten-verlusttoepfe/

•

Bubu@Bubu_98

6Mon

@Snoopyjs ok thanks! I hope that works. Then I could theoretically just sell shares and these profits would be offset against the "other loss pot"?

••

Jürgen S.@Snoopyjs

6Mon

@Bubu_98 Yes, it should work like this

••

Matthias@Aequitas

6Mon

I've just looked into it a bit and asked the ki. She can't really confirm your statement. I assume that this is German tax law:

"Situation in Germany
In Germany, there are two pots, but offsetting is a one-way street.
The share pot: Only losses from individual shares end up here. These are "isolated" and may only be offset against share gains.
The general pot ("Other"): This is where losses from certificates (such as its knock-out), warrants, ETFs, interest and dividends end up.
The crucial point: losses from the general pot may very well be offset against gains from individual shares in Germany.
Bubu writes: "The certificate ends up in the 'other' loss pot, while individual shares are isolated in the share pot."
That is wrong. Only the losses from shares are isolated. The gains from shares are "fair game" and can be neutralized by losses from certificates (other)."

"Bubu writes in the forum: "I have dutifully paid withholding tax on my equity gains."
This often happens because brokers pay the tax immediately when the shares are sold. With many banks, the offsetting against the loss pot only takes place with a delay (e.g. overnight or at the end of the month) or even only via the annual tax certificate.
Bubu therefore sees the tax deducted and panics, even though he gets the money back in the end (automatically or via a tax return)."

Of course, the ki may be wrong. If I were you, I would simply write a low-threshold ticket to the broker and ask.

•

Bubu@Bubu_98

6Mon

@Aequitas ok I hope that works. Then I could theoretically just sell shares and these profits would be offset against the "Other losses pot"?

••

Matthias@Aequitas

6Mon

@Bubu_98 That's how I understand it, but it makes sense to ask and have it confirmed given the amounts involved.

••

financial_wizard96@financial_wizard96

6Mon

Just wait until the BVerfG soon declares the current law on offsetting unconstitutional

•

Matthias@Aequitas

6Mon

Isn't it also the case that these "pots" are only valid for one year? In other words, you would only have until 31.12 to offset them with gains. At least that's the case with "normal" shares and etfs.

••

TomTurboInvest@TomTurboInvest

6Mon

@Aequitas In Austria, the capital gains tax balance is unfortunately set to zero on December 31. In Germany, losses can be carried forward to subsequent years.

•

Soprano@Soprano

6Mon

@TomTurboInvest Thanks, I was just about to write that

••

Jürgen S.@Snoopyjs

6Mon

@Aequitas As long as you do not apply for a loss certificate to offset losses from several banks against each other in your tax return, they will remain in place...even over the calendar year

••

Matthias@Aequitas

6Mon

@TomTurboInvest time to move 😅

••

TomTurboInvest@TomTurboInvest

6Mon

@Aequitas No, I'm not leaving beautiful Austria anymore, especially not to move to DE. I don't care about taxes, you can't treat yourself to anything else 😂

•

Matthias@Aequitas

6Mon

@TomTurboInvest 10 horses won't get me out of here...not even if they come from kickl himself

•

AI sagt@GoDividend

6Mon

@TomTurboInvest come to your beautiful country every year. I can understand that. But I only ever see the sunny side 🤣

•

KoenigsRasse@KoenigsRasse

6Mon

Unfortunately, you have fallen right into the German tax logic trap:
Losses from certificates end up in the "other" pot - and this is strictly separate from shares.

The inconvenient truth:
You can only offset the €8,000 against gains from derivatives. Shares, ETFs or dividends help you exactly zero.

Now for the solution without casino mode:
-Controlled instead of leveraged: if at all, then only very moderately (e.g. bonus or discount certificates or mini-leverage). The aim is not to gamble, but to reduce the pot of losses bit by bit.
Think long-term: You can simply leave the pot and slowly offset it over the years - it does not expire.
-Optional for advanced investors: Options (e.g. covered calls) can also deliver "other profits", but only if you know what you are doing.
Clean separation: Many people do well with 2 portfolios - one for investments, one for "tax clean-up work".

What doesn't work:
Offsetting equity gains, dividends or ETFs - simply doesn't work.

••

OraclevonFranconia@OraclevonFranconia911

6Mon

@KoenigsRasse This is simply wrong, please do some research. Other loss pots can be offset against dividends, among other things

••

KoenigsRasse@KoenigsRasse

6Mon

You are mixing up the old logic with the current legal situation.

Basically, it's true: The "other" pot is broader than the equity pot.
But losses from futures transactions (e.g. knock-outs) have been subject to their own rules since Section 20 (6) EStG and can only be offset to a limited extent.

This is precisely why "simply offsetting with dividends/ETFs" does not work in such cases, as is often assumed.

••

Bino@WarrenWobuffet

6Mon

@KoenigsRasse I think you missed something... it has been deleted without replacement since 2024. You are welcome to read the current version.

••

View one more answer

UliB@UliB

6Mon

Comment was deleted

Waxman@Waxman

6Mon

@UliB even with a warrant profit of 30k and a loss of 30 k? Can't they be completely offset?

••

Bino@WarrenWobuffet

6Mon

@UliB This upper limit was removed with the Annual Tax Act 2024 and no longer applies.

••

UliB@UliB

6Mon

@Waxman First of all, I would like to point out to @WarrenWobuffet that there has been a new, more advantageous legal situation since 2024.
Nevertheless, to your question: Exactly, under the old rules you could have offset a maximum of €20,000 loss against €20,000 profit per year and would have paid tax on €10,000 profit. The remaining loss of €10,000 would have been carried forward to the next year and could then have been offset again.
But: this is now obsolete.

••

UliB@UliB

6Mon

@WarrenWobuffet thanks for the tip and sorry for my outdated statement 🫣. I'll correct the first post.

•

Bino@WarrenWobuffet

6Mon

@UliB And another adjustment in this context: since 2025, losses from securities written off or sold for no value can also be offset directly and no longer have to be claimed via KAP in the tax return. (The 20k limit also applied at that time). And you're welcome for the tip :)

•