1Yr·

Rent fetish in Germany: an indictment of the second-highest taxing EU country

An article from the series "Germany on the way to becoming an emerging market"


Hello folks!


As we did in the last survey, today we're not going to talk about stocks or markets in the direct sense, but rather about Germany's situation in the current political cosmos. Before we start, my disclaimer as always:


Disclaimer: This is not investment advice. It is also not an invitation to buy and/or sell financial products. I am merely expressing my opinion here. You are responsible for your own investments. I therefore accept no liability.


Let's start with some very nasty figures:


  • 50,5%


  • 1.6 million


  • 40% -50%


  • 5


What are these figures all about? Is it the probability that Schalke 04 will remain in the first division? Or that Bayern will win the championship after all?


Unfortunately not - the figures provide a very good picture of the tenant situation in Germany. In 2021, 50.5% of households lived as tenants and did not acquire property via their monthly installments. This makes Germany the EU leader in one discipline! No other country had such a high proportion of tenants in the year under review. Spain in particular, which is in crisis and faces various problems such as youth unemployment etc., has less than a quarter of its population as tenants. Our neighbor's neighbor is at just 24.2%. Conversely, this means that 75.8% live in an ownership relationship. At 35.35%, France is also significantly lower than Germany. Only Austria is reasonably close at 45.8%. For a long time, it feels like there is nothing at all (see (1)).


The 1.6 million are particularly relevant in this context, because in a country with such a high proportion of renters, a simple dynamic should take effect, which I explain below and should lead to a lower cost of living. Nevertheless, in 2022 there were just under 16% of households that had to spend 40% to 50% of their NET income on rent. This means that the household is considered to be "overstretched" and the problem is now getting worse every year. Whereas in 2021 it was one in eight households, it is now almost one in six households that are slipping into financial difficulties. If you compare this with the current rent burden of 27.8%, you arrive at a delta of almost double the amount that affected households have to spend on rent. New tenancy agreements from 2019 onwards have a particularly negative impact, causing costs to rise by almost 2.7% (see (1), (2)).


Why is this important?


In simplified terms, the concept of "rent" only works under the following conditions (see (3), (4), among others):


  • Your own income is not sufficient to pay off the financing from repayments and interest within a reasonable time frame
  • Own income is sufficient, but the real estate market is "overheated" and there is no net rental yield > 5% with a real estate investment focus
  • The payment of rent + ancillary costs results in a significantly lower cost factor, so investments are made in alternative asset classes (equities, bonds, REITs, gold, etc.)
  • The property is an old building that requires high maintenance reserves


These examples show us why it is not possible for some households to live within their own four walls. With reference to (4), we recognize various cost parameters in the statements:


  • Repayment and loan interest rate
  • Acquisition costs and rent
  • Rent and savings reserve of the tenant
  • Investment return
  • Maintenance


If we add these parameters together for the home buyer, we get the following equation:


Property purchase cost = loan repayment + interest repayment + maintenance costs


So why do so many people hesitate when they "only" have to show 5 annual salaries for an average apartment? This figure is less than half that of the Czech Republic, for example, with 11 (!) annual salaries, and is a burden on long-term wealth accumulation?


There is a simple answer to this: because sub-factors such as loan repayments and, in recent months, interest repayments have become immensely more expensive. If we take 2010 as the standard measure for real estate prices with 100 index points, real estate would be at 196 index points in 2022 (see (5), (6)).


What does that mean?


In 2021, the average apartment had 92.1 sqm of living space. To simplify matters, we assume that other rooms such as the area under a staircase or rooms for shared use are not considered here for the time being. This means that the apartment would cost today (see (6), (7), (8)):


92.1 sqm * €3,372 average price Q4 2022 = €310,561.20 (!)


What would this apartment have cost in 2010? It's easy, because index:


92.1 sqm * €3,372 average price Q4 2022 * (100 index points 2010 / 196 index points 2022) = €310,561.20 * 0.51 = 158.386,22€


Yes, but wage increases and inflation?


The problem with this immense growth factor of almost 2 is that salaries have not kept pace. While the average net salary in 2010 was €1,638 per month, in 2021 it will be €2,172, excluding children in tax class 1. The associated salary burden was 31.8% in 2010 and 32.2% in 2021 (see (11)). Accordingly, on average an increase in salary of:


534€ was made possible. Calculated on the original salary of €1,638 per month, this is:


32.6% more, which is in contrast to the 96% more for the real estate purchase.

So we quickly realize that the payment via the average salary for real estate has increased by a factor of 96/33 = 2.9 to the detriment of the salary. This means that the loan repayment has increased by this factor. I therefore summarize the loan repayment as follows:


  • Near doubling of the price of existing properties
  • No tax relief due to the taxes relevant to the salary
  • No complete compensation of the real estate price development through salary increases
  • Consistency in the tenant share greater than 50%



Yes, you read that right. Surprisingly, the breakdown by tenant and owner is nevertheless surprisingly constant (see (9)).


In addition to existing properties, building your own property may also be an interesting way to start owning your own home. In contrast to existing properties, the greatest individual advantage here is that all rooms and areas can be adapted according to your own ideas - no frills, no major deviations from your own expectations due to different time frames. Selected examples of this based on old buildings are (see also (14)):


  • high ceilings
  • rotten stairs due to outdated material
  • Asbestos in the exterior walls
  • Oil heating systems
  • No insulation of the roof
  • Simple glazing of windows


The factor surrounding asbestos in particular is a fascinating example of the divergence in the ideas mentioned. Asbestos found its way into the construction of new properties from 1930 onwards and was particularly valued for its chemical resistance, tolerance of greater heat in the house itself and, despite this, its poor combustibility. This means that real estate investors who are interested in old buildings can also become acquainted with the past. Asbestos was also previously used in car brake linings due to its robustness (see (14)).


Today this is judged quite differently. Personally, it reminds me of a shiny bling-bling solution that subsequently proved to be less advantageous. Because every strength can also be seen as a weakness. Asbestos owes its aforementioned robustness primarily to its structure - unsurprisingly. Everyone knows the yellow fiber-like blocks with a diameter of up to 2 micrometers. Few people are aware, however, that this fibrous nature means that asbestos can theoretically pose a great danger to people who are surrounded by it. It's easy to understand: since we're talking about 1/1000 of a millimeter of fibrous material, it's possible to inhale these fibers - so what? Why important (cf. ibid.)?


What goes in should come out at some point. This is difficult with asbestos - the inhaled particles may remain in the lungs, which can irritate the corresponding tissue in the long term. As early as 1936, asbestos gained the unflattering fame of a disease named after it - asbestosis. asbestosis.


Why is this important for investors?


If the decision is made not to build a house or to rent, the disillusionment is very quick - even if prices on the real estate market are falling, they are still at a record level, as explained above. At the same time, inflation remains high, forcing many - especially young families - to struggle with old properties. The issue of asbestos removal then quickly becomes a major cost driver.


Yes, but surely that's only important for your old 1930s apartments and houses?


No - the answer is no. Asbestos has only been banned since 1993. We are currently living in 2023 (at least in terms of the calendar year). This means that as soon as houses from the 70s, 80s and sometimes even the 90s are used, the spectre of asbestos starts to haunt us. This is often a danger in the absence of an exposé or when viewing old properties without an estate agent. Not every possibly elderly owner has a financial interest in having an expert confirm the presence of asbestos in the house, which a) costs money and b) may negatively affect the value of the property. This is because the removal of asbestos always involves professional disposal. Asbestos comes in many forms, such as sewage pipes, the aforementioned insulation and also Eternit panels. A rough 0815 thumb value is approx. 30 € minimum up to 45 € per sqm (see (15), (16)).


This means that either the price of the property has to fall OR an expert has to dispose of it professionally. This can very quickly become quite expensive and be on a par with the ancillary purchase costs that are due for this property. Here is a simple example to show where the costs come from. We use cost drivers - costs in € (see (15), (16), (17)):


Transportation of the MA & equipment to the old property

-Depending on distance 50€-150€

Hire and erection of the scaffolding,

(so that the MA can reach the roof, for example)

-Depending on the scaffolding, approx. 1,000€ - 1,200€

Removal of the asbestos sheets via manpower

-Roof area 150 QM * 35€/QM (we assume 150 QM for this)

Disposal of approx. 12 tons of hazardous waste

-150€ lump sum * 12 tons

Drainage of the roof

-1.000€

Re-installation of the insulation

-Approx. 10,000€ (depending on various factors)

Installation of slates

-60€ per sqm * 150 sqm roof area

Personnel costs

4-5 days workload with approx. 3 full-time employees


You can quickly see why old buildings in particular may not be worthwhile. In this simple example with a large fluctuation interval, we have ADDITIONAL costs of:


Minimum: 28,100€ + 4 days personnel costs


Maximum: 28,400€ + 5 days of personnel costs


This often shatters the dream of an old property for young families who do not want to be tied down by this additional cost factor plus a possible disadvantage when reselling the property due to its age.


What does the state do?


For example, demanding heat pumps, offering subsidies via "climate-friendly new builds", which will already be empty in June of this year, and making a real dent in ancillary purchase costs (cf. (17), (18)).


The ancillary costs ALWAYS consist of the following components, among others (cf. (19), (20):


  • Costs for the notary
  • Costs for entry in the land register
  • Land transfer tax


Yes, there are other parameters, but these three in particular are incurred. The land transfer tax is the one that the government could most easily tweak. There is currently a wide range here. Here are some examples:


  • Bavaria with 3.5% real estate transfer tax
  • Hamburg with 4.5% real estate transfer tax
  • Thuringia with 6.5% real estate transfer tax


Notary and land registry fees are fairly similar throughout Germany at around 2%. The optional but frequently occurring estate agent fees are a maximum of 3.57%. As a result, there is a fairly wide range across the federal states mentioned of:


  • Bavaria at 9.07% total ancillary purchase costs
  • Hamburg at 10.07% total ancillary purchase costs
  • Thuringia at 12.07% total ancillary purchase costs


Of course, we know that prices are currently very high in many Bavarian areas (cough Munich cough). Nevertheless, a difference of 12.07% - 9.07% = 3% for a standard property of €310,561.20 can make a big difference. In comparison, that would be approx:


310.561,20€ * 12,07% = 37.484,74€


Or


310.561,20 * 9,07% = 28.167,90€


So a delta of: 9.316,84€


Especially for families with a low income, this sum can mean an enormous relief.

If that was too much practical real estate discussion for you, you might prefer to watch my new real estate video on the REITS Realty Income, Gladstone Commercial and the Longfor Group from Hong Kong! Originated from a community wish - make a wish :D


https://youtu.be/dI5S-QArzv8


How do you see it? Are you team owner or team tenant? I know that this is a sensitive issue. The factions are often Tenants4Life and the PropertyHoodbros are often difficult to reconcile. I just ask you to remain respectful in the comments - as always :)


Thank you and see you next time! I look forward to your constructive feedback! :)


Your Bass-T



Sources


(1) https://www.destatis.de/Europa/DE/Thema/Bevoelkerung-Arbeit-Soziales/Soziales-Lebensbedingungen/Mieteranteil.html

(2) https://www.haufe.de/immobilien/entwicklung-vermarktung/marktanalysen/wohnkostenbelastung-in-deutschland-miete-versus-einkommen_84324_521164.html

(3) https://www.businessinsider.de/wirtschaft/immobilien-paradox-warum-deutschland-ein-land-der-mieter-ist-2019-7/

(4) https://zendepot.de/kaufen-oder-mieten/

(5) https://www.finanztip.de/baufinanzierung/mieten-oder-kaufen/

(6) https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/244262/umfrage/immobilienpreisindex-fuer-eigenheime-in-deutschland/

(7) https://www.umweltbundesamt.de/daten/private-haushalte-konsum/wohnen/wohnflaeche

(8) https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/554954/umfrage/kaufpreise-fuer-eigentumswohnungen-aller-baujahre-in-deutschland/

(9) https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/237719/umfrage/verteilung-der-haushalte-in-deutschland-nach-miete-und-eigentum/

(10) https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/39044/umfrage/monatlicher-verdienst-in-deutschland-seit-2000/

(11) https://www.sozialpolitik-aktuell.de/files/sozialpolitik-aktuell/_Politikfelder/Finanzierung/Datensammlung/PDF-Dateien/tabII7.pdf

(12) https://www.interhyp.de/ratgeber/was-muss-ich-wissen/zinsen/zins-charts/


(13) https://www.finanztip.de/baufinanzierung/hypothekenzinsen/


(14) https://www.umweltbundesamt.de/themen/gesundheit/umwelteinfluesse-auf-den-menschen/chemische-stoffe/asbest


(15) https://wohnglueck.de/artikel/asbest-entsorgen-73149

(16) https://www.listando.de/p/was-kostet-eine-asbestbeseitigung/

(17) https://www.borchers-asbestkiller.de/haeufige-fragen

(18) https://www.co2online.de/modernisieren-und-bauen/waermepumpe/

(19) https://www.morgenpost.de/wirtschaft/article237984801/klimafreundlicher-neubau-geld-foerderung-wird-knapp-kfn.html

(20) https://ratgeber.immowelt.de/a/nebenkosten-beim-hauskauf-oder-hausbau.html#c41785


#immobilien
#immobilie
#reit
#sanierung
#hauskauf
#dividends
#gladstone
#realtyincome
#longforgroup

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70 Comments

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I am an owner, but see the whole thing with the evil statistics to 50.5% rent relaxed. We must also realize that more and more young people want to move out early and live themselves. In other countries, you live in part almost until the 30th LJ with the parents and have saved capital until then to start when moving out and the wedding with the real estate financing. Especially in Southern and Eastern Europe, this trend is strong.
In Southern Europe, we also have many multi-generation houses where people live together for a long time in order to save costs. Incidentally, we removed the asbestos from one of our side properties almost 10 years ago. 2 other side properties are still waiting to be cleaned up, but there is simply not enough time for the necessary work. If possible, we do a lot ourselves and only hire companies for the things that are really necessary, e.g. professional disposal, etc.
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@Staatsmann That's always a huge advantage when you can do a lot of things yourself. Sometimes you wait weeks for an appointment and as soon as it arrives, you lose even more time because of a lack of materials :D It's really a nightmare at the moment. How difficult was it for you with the asbestos?
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@BASS-T It was quite simple and done in a short time. There were just asbestos sheets on the roof of the barn. Loosen the anchors, push them down, crush them on the ground and put them in the container. Then just call the company that picks up the container. Then put the old corrugated sheet metal on top as a new roof and that's it.
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@Staatsmann Then it worked out great.
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Dreaming of owning my own home for a long time - because I simply didn't know it any other way from my parents. Then I started to research, to calculate, to get clear about my personal preferences, wrote a series of articles on getquin [1] and finally came to the conclusion that property a) is currently too expensive and b) represents an incalculable risk. The money that I had saved for a home in safe forms of investment has been shifted into ETFs for some time. Currently, about 160k still need to be added to the portfolio. [1] https://app.getquin.com/activity/FoLdCxttXY
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@DonkeyInvestor I see it in a similar way at the moment. The question is whether one is really better off with a property at some point in old age. But that also depends on your own provision via shares and their dividends, whether you can close a pension gap with it if necessary. Great series of contributions. I liked it!
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@DonkeyInvestor Isn't the development of rents an incalculable risk? The housing shortage is currently getting much worse in urban areas, as construction projects are not increasing due to the current interest rate policy. My real estate loan, for example, runs for 20 years, I know my risk and can plan well over this period with regard to term and unscheduled repayment😊 Inflation also plays into the cards. But I can't plan how high my rent will be here in Munich in 20 years or how much I'll have to pay if I have to leave the rental apartment in 20 years. Of course, it's true that a lot of capital is tied up in the property, but once I've paid it off, I'll only have to pay incidental costs. For me personally, this is half the rent for the pension. Also, the risk regarding renovations breaks down to all units in my ETW. With an EFH, the risk regarding retention for renovations is a greater risk. Personally, I would do it again and again, even if the current rates will of course be higher than the rent payment.😊 Currently, however, I must also agree with you, the prices are still too high in relation to the increased interest rates🤚
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@Wellenreiter That's why I also see the floor apartment as a realistic alternative, despite the house money, as soon as the prices have caught up to some extent. Of course, you have to be the type for - party from 10 o'clock then only with the consent of the neighbors, but I would not mind. The simply also invite the same😊
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@BASS-T yes is always the question how much party you plan at home😂 at WG times in the study it would have been an unsolvable problem
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@Wellenreiter new laws like Habeck's or changes to the property tax, expensive modernizations, damage to the property for which no insurance pays, more effort for maintenance, missed opportunities due to commitment to a place, changes in family planning or simply children moving out, structural changes and thus loss of value, a declining population, lump risk real estate / Germany, ...In return, there are tenants who tend to belong to the poorer part of the population and therefore imho will be more protected by the state in the future. Of course, you can think about it from a financial point of view, if the EK share is low and the repayment + interest only marginally above the cold rent. But especially in Munich, this ratio is beyond good and evil.
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@DonkeyInvestor But on whom are modernizations or other increases and dreams of politics passed on? On the tenant, of course. Modernization is the best example of this. The state can no longer protect, quite simply because otherwise even less will be built if renting becomes too unattractive. A vicious circle the whole😅 I can live well with the lump risk regarding my choice of location. I grew up here in Munich, there are enough jobs and family is also based here. If, however, a property can be sold, or I rent😬 But yes, of course you're right that the change of location as a tenant is easier and much cheaper. As an example, my EK share was ~45%. I did not want to liquidate my portfolio for this. Alone the dividend yield is more than 0,83%😉 So in my case I don't really pay more than if I would live for rent. With lower EK share the "temporary" disadvantage compared to rent becomes bigger of course. You're right about that, but in the end I'm still paying into my own pocket, minus the interest. Loss of value vs. appreciation: well, both of those leave me cold for now, since I live there myself and so the loss or gain is irrelevant to me. I don't see my owner-occupied ETW as a speculative object. But yes, saving up the equity meant making sacrifices and didn't come flying out of the sky. Many people always forget this when they rail against the "rich" owners😉.
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@Wellenreiter Yes, it is passed on to tenants. But when I see older people who need to modernize but can't afford it, it's a completely different story than paying a few euros more rent per month. As a landlord, you have completely different options (e.g. tax) compared to an owner-occupier.

If you rent or sell the property, you have more stress and have to rent afterwards (or accept the then valid purchase prices and financing options). On the contrary, a high equity ratio is rather a hindrance, since this is very likely to work much better for you on the stock market than in an owner-occupied property. But financial aspects are not everything. The most important thing is that you feel comfortable with your decision 👍
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@DonkeyInvestor yes, basically it's like you say. A case by case decision👍
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@BASS-T but depends a lot on your neighbors... I'm currently really happy not to live in my (professional) shared apartment for too long. My roommates are top, location top, landlady top, cleaning staff as well. Above them, a family with 5 children has just moved in (2 months to 7 years old). The children are 90% of the day in the apartment, through the (beautiful) old building you can hear the children with Bobbycar and scooter brettern over the floorboards. The wife and her boyfriend (is probably not the father) yell at each other half the day long ... 2 months ago there lived an old couple, which you have never heard (!). For me, therefore, in the long run really only a detached EFH again in question - as soon as the price is halfway reasonable. You can certainly have a lot of luck with his neighbors, but is always a bit of coincidence. In the implementation of a home theater is usually the end in the multi-party house anyway. Have now saved a lot of money for many years by small apartments, but slowly I long again for what I know from childhood. Just do not see it to pay 500k € + for it.
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@KevinC I understand that all too well. It remains exciting what happens on the real estate market. I just hope so slowly for reasonable prices.👍
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Have bought a townhouse 11 years ago (Hesse) before prices went through the roof. Value has recently almost tripled (although slightly declining), more extensive issues (heating, roof, etc.) are spread more widely by the owners- community. Costs about the same as rent, but well before retirement the cottage is ours. What I find but really scary, which couples have tied in recent years here houses for 500k or significantly above on the hoes. At the latest with the post-financing here a lot of dreams will burst :-(
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@MCS_1983 I wonder what will happen to the real estate market when the follow-up financing bursts in rows. Where will the families live then?
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@MCS_1983 I know enough people there, too. As a rule, the promised building plots, for example, are then simply returned and it remains with a smaller apartment.
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@Epi In any case, nothing good. Either over-indebtedness or finding a compromise via a smaller rental apartment.
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@Epi I'm almost certain that this will be a major issue. Where the affordable housing is to come from so quickly will have to be seen. Our government certainly has that under control and already what sensible in the drawer😂. In my opinion, the banks also bear a massive share of the blame here for the families/individuals. What there for sums were given out without hedging, some really grossly unreasonable.
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@MCS_1983 But seriously: what happens then, especially if there are no small rental apartments? Maybe the families just stay in their houses and the banks write off part of the loan and shift it to the ECB. The ECB keeps interest rates low and drives up inflation, so that the tenants, in particular, pay the debts with monetary capital via devaluation?
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@Epi a very good question, would also interest me very much
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@MCS_1983 I don't understand it either. When I think about how far people get into debt, I get goose bumps! We are also home owners. Our follow-up financing is since the beginning of the year save. We bought 10 years ago. At a good interest rate. When the ECB announced the first increases, I immediately consulted with the bank. The last years we have a better interest rate as the 10 years before. Our plan worked and we are a good 10-15 years before retirement through. We live in Saarland and here the prices are now rising immeasurably. With our neighbors, the Palatinate it is even worse. There the Luxemburger make the prices kaputt.
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@Zony Well done! I wonder, however, whether the German state can even bear the sight of debt-ridden real estate owners or think up something new again, as for example after the 2nd World War in the FRG?
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@Epi We will see where it still goes. Currently in the direction of the Stone Age. I would have said, as in the past, back to the campfire. But even that will soon be forbidden......armes Germany!
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Team tenant owner-occupied property often does not make sense. If you tie a house to your leg, which increases in value but you had to contribute a lot to the increase in value. Add the purchase or fictitious sales costs. The increase in value is not so high
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Can you stop with this investment advice crap? No one can be held liable here and even if they were, you think an informal three-liner in a forum would save you if that were the case. Ridiculous.
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@JulianKopp Do you have anything constructive to contribute to the topic? Or ever seen a podcast, stock blog or Youtube video? The disclaimer is a legal standard and if you think you have to act without a disclaimer, that is your personal risk. Nothing more, nothing less. just because of your sensitivities, I'm not going to expose myself to legal gray areas. "Ridiculous."
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@JulianKopp Tell me that you have no idea without telling me that you have no idea. Too bad with the hate here. Is really a great contribution. Such a thing really does not have to be.
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@BASS-T There is no risk, always this nonsense.
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@WarrenBuffetFanboy69 You just did.
50.5% that is more than I would have expected/imagined
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@StocksElements Sad somewhere, but also understandable with the current inflation real estate situation.
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just for info: the swiss have 57 % rent share
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@lukasdinvestiert Exciting, do you have property there?
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@BASS-T no unfortunately not, i am from austria myself and only 23. in vienna and its environs (where i live), however, ownership is probably often not profitable, as rents are not that expensive, ownership on the other hand is...
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@lukasdinvestiert Write a post about it😎
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By the way, there is an inverse relationship between home ownership and GDPpP. The poorer a country, the more home ownership. On average, I am a private tenant, but I keep my eyes open. My limit for purchase price is 20 annual net cold rents. For this, however, the real estate would have to become 50% cheaper at present.
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@Epi Am curious if the real estate market will erode that much.
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@Epi Is there only a causal relationship or does this statement really correlate?
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@NiMe Which statement of the two are you referring to?
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@Epi Your second sentence 👍🏻
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@BASS-T I wonder about that, too. Especially whether this is happening in a situation where I am happy not to own a property.
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@NiMe Nah, real estate doesn't get cheaper because I set that limit. 😅 Otherwise, the 50% slump is condition for me to consider real estate as an alternative to rent.
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@Epi you're talking about your second paragraph. i'm talking about your second sentence. lol
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@Epi This is the supreme discipline in the real estate business. The way I see it, with interest rates possibly falling soon, things are threatening to get worse again with prices.
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@NiMe I see! Haha! I don't believe that there is a causal relationship between wealth and rental rates. The USA and Norway don't look poor, but it can't be true that a high rental rate puts us in an emerging market state, because the ownership rate in emerging markets is higher.
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@BASS-T The majority expects interest rates to fall soon. I somehow don't see that, at least not in the next 2 years. Inflation is just too high, core inflation is even rising. The wage effects are just kicking in in about 12 months. If one looks at the 70's, we will have to do until approx. 2030 with high inflation and/or Inflation'swellen. There it becomes still colorful with real estates! Particularly since so 2027 the large collapse under the Boomerkinder arrives. Vacancy plus high interest rates plus political pressure = (can you think)!
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@BASS-T maybe i'll do that sometime, but it will be difficult to get close to your contribution standard. but that would certainly be an interesting topic.
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@lukasdinvestiert I would be pleased 👍
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Team owner, as I could buy cheaply, namely just under 1000€/m2 (all inclusive). Have asbestos on the roof, but that can be disposed of cheaply, because bound. Otherwise, the previous owners were total renovation freaks and throughout the house are copper pipes for water. Only the electrical system is partly stupid, but I can do that myself step by step and then have a friend electrician accept. Oh yes, 24k was paid by the state through the building subsidy. That was really nice. Too bad that there was nothing more for the latecomer.
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@devnerd_daddy Wasn't the disposal of asbestos a bigger problem then?
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@devnerd_daddy ui that is really very cheap. I have paid for my first condo about 1950€/m2 and this is year of construction 1926. And since the new property tax assessment it has now risen 100k in price 🥳.
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@BASS-T Haven't done it yet, but bonded asbestos is very cheap because you don't have to disguise anything on the house. Costs somehow 600€ the ton, so even if two tons of tiles are on the roof I don't really care. I will connect that directly with a new roof, means then the workers are there anyway and the normal disposal would cost yes also what. As of today, it would be about 70k€ for a completely new roof with insulation, etc.. Since the disposal is the Peanuts part 😅
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@RealRose Ui, that beats mine. My cabin was built in 1939 and funnily enough the builder kept the entire materials list. I had binders full of original bills from the hardware store from 1938 and 1939 with the exact amounts in Reichsmarks. Most of it I threw away, I kept only the Ariernachweis, which was necessary for the construction and a few other souvenirs, such as the official permission of the broadcasting station for the installation of a TV set :D
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@RealRose Congratulations 😂🎉
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@devnerd_daddy These are sums😳
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@devnerd_daddy the more important question where is your house? my apartment is in Dresden.
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@BASS-T After the heating madness of the Greens, it can also be that I have to sell my retirement provision tax-free again in 2027 🫣 And the new property tax is supposed to be unconstitutional and could be overturned again.
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@RealRose For me it is Montabaur, so perfectly located between Frankfurt and Cologne. ICE, A3, everything there :D I am currently very relaxed about the heating. No politician in the world can afford to have too many voters sitting on the street or driving too hard on the edge financially. Acting rashly now means buying stuff at overpriced prices. I wait for now and do what I can on my own. Meanwhile I pay off dutifully and if my hut then in approx. 7 years with belongs, I have so much monthly budget freely that I can rebuild, until the physician comes. Rash action is always dangerous and plays into the hands of those who exploit exactly such situations. I heat with gas and of course it has become a bit more expensive, but until a new heating system has paid for itself, decades pass; I don't see that happening. So for now I wait and see to what extent I can combine work in good order. (For example, with each new floor I lay a piece of new heating). I myself am not completely unskilled and my father is a craftsman, from there I could do cost-saving many things that help me. Again, in my opinion, this is a pitfall of real estate. If you have no idea, craftsmen can tell you anything.
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@BASS-T you speak from my soul. Conservative and liberal statements with a pleasant capitalist spin. And far away from the Woke-ESG stuff, without having aluhut airs. That's good!
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