3Mon
...the crazy thing is that it's almost impossible for the average employee (e.g. me) to work out which is more worthwhile. At least not without weeks of research and support from people who are well versed in the subject.
I can invest up to €150/month in a U-Kasse, of which the employer pays 50%. I can also take out direct insurance for another €150 with a 20% subsidy from the employer. If I do both, I get an additional €2,000 bonus per year.
Sounds great at first. In 2023 (in which an MSCI Wolrd makes ~20%, Allianz will then have earned a strong 3.4% interest.
After 10 years, the Allianz advisor tells me that it would allegedly not be possible to show me how much return my BAV has generated in 10 years (a rogue who thinks evil of it...)
Switching to the new alliance tariff is possible, then up to 60% of the payment would go into ETFs of my choice (statutory maximum). But then you'd have to pay the full acquisition fees for the new contract again.
Now you have to calculate how much the employer's subsidy is, whether the pension is reduced, whether private health insurance makes sense and gets more money out of it.... At this point at the latest, every normal person stops and simply hopes that money will come out in the end.... but you can't speak of full transparency here.
For 10 years I simply accepted that the entire subsidy from the employer would be top...and then there would be (some) money when I retired, even if I gambled away everything else in my life... a secure alternative asset, so to speak, that can withstand drugs and rock'n'roll. Allianz earns money for this security ;-)
I can invest up to €150/month in a U-Kasse, of which the employer pays 50%. I can also take out direct insurance for another €150 with a 20% subsidy from the employer. If I do both, I get an additional €2,000 bonus per year.
Sounds great at first. In 2023 (in which an MSCI Wolrd makes ~20%, Allianz will then have earned a strong 3.4% interest.
After 10 years, the Allianz advisor tells me that it would allegedly not be possible to show me how much return my BAV has generated in 10 years (a rogue who thinks evil of it...)
Switching to the new alliance tariff is possible, then up to 60% of the payment would go into ETFs of my choice (statutory maximum). But then you'd have to pay the full acquisition fees for the new contract again.
Now you have to calculate how much the employer's subsidy is, whether the pension is reduced, whether private health insurance makes sense and gets more money out of it.... At this point at the latest, every normal person stops and simply hopes that money will come out in the end.... but you can't speak of full transparency here.
For 10 years I simply accepted that the entire subsidy from the employer would be top...and then there would be (some) money when I retired, even if I gambled away everything else in my life... a secure alternative asset, so to speak, that can withstand drugs and rock'n'roll. Allianz earns money for this security ;-)
•
11
•
3Mon
@Ludaaa7 You said it, it's all far too complicated for Normlos. And hope (for a little extra income) dies last.
But at the latest when you retire, you'll have to pick up your calculator and decide whether the guaranteed pension with a tax-free amount but expropriation and minimum interest rate is better or a payout with approx. 50% tax but sensible further investment.
That will hurt!
But at the latest when you retire, you'll have to pick up your calculator and decide whether the guaranteed pension with a tax-free amount but expropriation and minimum interest rate is better or a payout with approx. 50% tax but sensible further investment.
That will hurt!
••
@Ludaaa7 but you also pay your share from your gross and not from your net as with an ETF. In addition, you receive a subsidy from your employer and have therefore already paid in around twice as much as with an ETF (with the same actual expenditure). Furthermore, you only pay tax on the income from the ETF each year when it is paid out. At retirement age, you pay tax on the payout at your personal pension tax rate and still benefit from the allowances for health insurance. At the same time, with a provident fund you can still benefit from the one-fifth rule for tax purposes. Furthermore, you have no risk of loss as with an etf and your investment is even Hartz4 protected during the savings phase or safe in the event of personal insolvency. And if you choose the pension benefit on payout, you are guaranteed to receive it for life with an annual increase in the pension. So even up to the age of 111. In summary, occupational pension provision is lucrative and the best choice for retirement provision. In my opinion, an etf is also interesting but is more suitable as an additional medium- to long-term investment. Furthermore, an etf is not comparable in character to a pension plan, where longevity is still insured!
••
2Mon
@market_analyst_5 All these points are taken into account in the contribution. And yet the occupational pension scheme is dramatically worse. Where is the mistake?
••