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fiducation · 2024-09-23T13:17:07.237771Z

Wir haben uns entschieden in den italienischen Yachtbauer The Italian Sea Group zu investieren. Das Unternehmen stand zuletzt vor allem durch den britischen Milliardär Lynch im Fokus. Hier klagt man jetzt gegen die Witwe und die Crew wegen eines möglichen Imageschadens. Das Unternehmen bedient aus unserer Sicht mehrere Megatrends, da man vor allem HNIs als Kunden hat. Es werden hauptsächlich Superyachten mit einer Länge von mehr als 50 Metern gebaut. Das Auftragsvolumen reicht für die kommenden 2 - 3 Jahre. Das Unternehmen ist profitabel, wächst zweistellig und zahlt eine hohe Dividendenrendite. Auch im Vergleich zur Peer-Group ist das Unternehmen aus unserer Sicht attraktiv bewertet. Die Bilanz ist solide, die Verschuldung hält sich in Grenzen. Was haltet ihr vom Unternehmen?

fiducation

@fiducation

3Mes·

We have decided to invest in the Italian yacht builder The Italian Sea Group.

The company has recently been in the spotlight due to the British billionaire Lynch. A lawsuit is now being filed against the widow and the crew for possible damage to the company's image.

In our view, the company serves several megatrends, as its customers are primarily HNIs. It mainly builds superyachts with a length of more than 50 meters. The order volume is sufficient for the next 2 - 3 years. The company is profitable, has double-digit growth and pays a high dividend yield.

In our view, the company is also attractively valued compared to its peer group. The balance sheet is solid and debt is limited.

What do you think of the company?

23.09

TIS

TISG

Acquistato x84 a 8,455 €

710,22 €

70 Commenti

Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

4 out of 20 of your stocks are up?! How do you do that in the current market situation? Fascinating how badly you can invest ... Dirk Müller is the messiah compared to you

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Alpalaka@Alpalaka

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 Pssssst. That's not the point

Edit: Sit back and chow down on popcorn

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 Have a look at the transaction history 😉

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 if you only sell losers, the portfolio naturally looks better, but there is no reason to present our portfolio unnecessarily well here.

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation And then? You are gambling on turnarounds, nothing more. I really hope you don't manage client money

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation I don't sell anything because I don't buy such ragged companies. In my case, 2 out of 119 companies are down more than 15%

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 you mean because we beat the market, which most fund managers can't do, yes, the clients would be poor 😂

We don't gamble on turnarounds either, but often, of course, cheaply valued companies have come back from high valuations in some form.

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation You also have terrible timing! Well, I'm up 20% with Cloudflare

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 You are the hottest! 👌

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation Anyone can claim

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation Better than you and I don't presume to want to advise other people

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Alpalaka@Alpalaka

3Mes

Isn't justifying yourself too exhausting?
Why don't you just share your portfolio before you have to justify yourself to all the accounts :)

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@Alpalaka Do they do that from time to time?

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Alpalaka@Alpalaka

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 Have a look through the posts. You had similar stress six months ago :D

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 no, you were the only two who wanted to see it 😂 We also share the portfolio and every new transaction. It could hardly be more public.

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@Alpalaka Oh, it was them. They just say they don't track, but claim they're better than the market. Holy shit

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 💩 Reading comprehension topic

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation What does reading comprehension have to do with the fact that I seem to have successfully blocked you out?

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 read the comment before 😂

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Alpalaka@Alpalaka

3Mes

@fiducation oh, I thought there would have been more.
I don't care about your portfolio at all. I'm only interested in the (possibly unknown) stocks in the respective year.
Whether you outperformed what and how is irrelevant to me

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Alpalaka wouldn't mention it either if we weren't talking about the overall performance, but about the individual stocks we post here 😅

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Alpalaka@Alpalaka

3Mes

@fiducation Point goes to you :D

However, you do like to mention your outperformance when criticism comes your way

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Visualizza tutti 5 ulteriori risposte

Dominik@Dominik_76

3Mes

We will have to wait and see what the investigation into the Bayesian reveals. Because if the allegations about the alleged misconduct of the crew cannot be confirmed, but are refuted, then this could cause other waves. After the tragedy with the supposedly unsinkable Titanic, it seems very risky to describe a ship or yacht as unsinkable, given the many possible risks.

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DieEnte7@DieEnte7

3Mes

@Dominik_76 It's true, the accident itself is of course tragic, but unfortunately tragedies happen from time to time, what's more problematic for me is what happened afterwards. I think I would have baked much smaller rolls. If it is really proven that the accident would not have happened without any misconduct on the part of the crew, I can still use the information to my advantage, but statements like that barely a day after the accident sound very unprofessional to me. And the company's lawsuit against the widow for damage to its image is completely banal in my view, at least at this point in time.

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Dominik@Dominik_76

3Mes

@DieEnte7 Agree with you. They are already going into attack mode while the investigation is still ongoing. According to a report I read, the allegations are not supported by witnesses either.

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

especially almost only Germans. Not enough horizon for more or what?

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 Yes, we don't understand English, so we only analyze German companies. It's already in the name, The Italian Sea Group.

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation work on your reading comprehension. There is the small but important word almost. Shall I explain to you what the difference is between only and almost only?

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 On the subject of reading comprehension, what is your assessment of the company in question?

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation I don't have any. I a) don't invest in extreme small caps and b) avoid southern companies and c) don't invest in anything you recommend

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 then keep your other opinions to yourself, because your unnecessary trolling without any added value for others misses the point.

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation I just want to warn you ... inexperienced investors could be influenced by something like this and buy blindly

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 So you want to warn against one of the few honest accounts that doesn't enter transactions incorrectly, has outperformed the market with its portfolio and communicates all transactions transparently? Thanks for that, @Kundenservice should award you a medal.

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation Where did you outperform the market? I don't see it in the picture? It says Value 20% and Growth -24%? Where do I see the overall performance? I had plus 7.39% in 2023, without crypto 8.42% and you?

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 this is the tracking of the value portfolio we share here, which you can see here. We have outperformed with it. Not with the Growth Portfolio. We don't track our private portfolios in such a precise way. Some of them are also ETFs where tracking is unnecessary.

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 Sorry, I completely misread the numbers. 2023 36.51% with crypto and 22.98% without crypto

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Visualizza tutti 9 ulteriori risposte

Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

weren't you on the heroes who sold SEA this year? Great sale you noobs

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 You mean because we're out profitably? Yes, it was terrible

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation as with all your buys and sells, bad timing. But I've got my eye on you. You seem to be the perfect contra-indicator. Priceless like that

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 Yes, all of our purchases and sales are terrible, hence the outperformance.

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation where is the evidence?

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 https://www.instagram.com/p/C1r2CF4MVnp/?igsh=MWp3c2kyZDdlZTA5cQ==

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation and? Where do I see your performance for 2023? and how is that validated?

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@Ayecaramba256 How are your transactions validated here? You are welcome to go through our posts from the last few years, we have posted all transactions directly here.

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation Just tell us your performance in 2023

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Ayecaramba@Ayecaramba256

3Mes

@fiducation I didn't claim to be better than the market. So I'm not at all responsible, you are ...

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DieEnte7@DieEnte7

3Mes

Interesting, I had recently considered selling my TISG shares (I've been holding them for about 9 months, a subsequent purchase at the beginning of the year, performance almost exactly +-0%). In the end, I decided against it after the earnings report was quite encouraging, but they are not quite so firmly in the saddle in my portfolio at the moment...

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@DieEnte7 Exciting, what do you think speaks in favor of a sale?

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DieEnte7@DieEnte7

3Mes

@fiducation So one of the main reasons was the accident you mentioned. It now seems quite certain that this was not related to a design fault, but if it was, I think it would be a debacle for the company. The risk is difficult to assess from media reports and as I have no idea about shipbuilding and the legal consequences of such a scenario, it was a bit much "uncertainty" for my taste. Given their market capitalization, I would have been unsure whether they would survive a possible conviction for misconduct.

The example of Meyer-Werft in Germany also shows that a good order situation does not automatically mean that the company is doing well. Although TISG and Meyer are two different companies, a few similar problems can certainly occur there too. In my view, both factors together have increased the risk of the share without at the same time increasing the opportunities, hence the idea of selling. At the moment, however, the factors are not yet strong enough for me to abandon my original investment case. But I'll keep a closer eye on this in the coming weeks.

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@DieEnte7 It is safe to assume that it was not a design fault. The hatches were probably open and the 10-meter keel was not extended. Hence the lawsuit, which could actually be an opportunity in this context.

Cruise ships and superyachts are two different segments. If you compare it with the clothing industry, Louis Vuitton achieves different margins than H&M.

TISG, for example, is also renovating Putin's alleged ship at the moment. In case of doubt, these are customers who are happy to pay a premium for secrecy. Morally questionable, but definitely more exciting than Meyer Werft for investors.

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DieEnte7@DieEnte7

3Mes

@fiducation Phew, just now I read about the lawsuit AGAINST the widow of the victim... that worries me, so if there was no damage to their image before, now they have. Who would have thought of that?

Then there are reports that the cooperation with Armani is in jeopardy and some customers have put their orders on hold. I'll have to take a look at this at my leisure, but it doesn't seem all that exciting to me.

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@DieEnte7 That's exactly why the widow and the crew are being sued. The lawsuit also suggests that there were no construction problems. Otherwise you would hardly be suing.

Also in bad taste in this case, but perhaps the very small group of HNIs tick a little differently than the majority of society.

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DieEnte7@DieEnte7

3Mes

@fiducation Nevertheless, this leaves a strange aftertaste. The market cap is 440 million and the company is being sued for 220. The figure has to come from somewhere, so if that really is the amount the company is using to quantify the damage to its image, then the correction so far seems very small to me. And as I said, if I were an HNI and heard that my widow could be sued by the shipbuilder if I sank on their ship, I would be outraged. And I don't think they can afford too many outraged customers. I hadn't even read that yet (thanks for that!), but it could be "the final straw" for me... 🤔

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fiducation@fiducation

3Mes

@DieEnte7 For us it was a nice way to get started, it's a question of observation.

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DieEnte7@DieEnte7

3Mes

@fiducation It would be boring if everyone had the same strategy, so good luck! 😜 However, I've done a bit of reading and may swap the position as soon as I've found a replacement that convinces me.

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