Covered calls and core position sounds strange. I hope you know what you are doing….
While I also have this ETF I’d never name it core since it would still have to prove how it reacts in a bear market
While I also have this ETF I’d never name it core since it would still have to prove how it reacts in a bear market
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@KeineuiI get your point. I see WINC more as a core income position than a traditional growth ETF. Even though since launch, WINC has actually tracked the MSCI World quite closely.
The covered calls are actually part of the appeal for me, as the premiums could potentially cushion some downside in a bear market, although they can also limit some upside. That said, WINC only launched in 2024, so we haven’t seen how it performs through a bear market yet.
The covered calls are actually part of the appeal for me, as the premiums could potentially cushion some downside in a bear market, although they can also limit some upside. That said, WINC only launched in 2024, so we haven’t seen how it performs through a bear market yet.
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@Keineui just a small thing, WINC allready survived his first bearmarket Feb 2025 , 20% drop with a very negative sentiment.
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@etfbaas A correction of a few months isn't a bear market
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•@BasicallyGambling Sure it was... for example the SP500 took 11 (November) month's to be on the same level as before the bearmarket in 2025..
And the all world ETF took 10 month's (Oktober) to be on the same level.
specially as the SP500 & All World ETF both are the most tracked ETF for benchmarks in portfolios..
And the all world ETF took 10 month's (Oktober) to be on the same level.
specially as the SP500 & All World ETF both are the most tracked ETF for benchmarks in portfolios..
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@etfbaas Just straight up making up facts now, nice.
1. On the 20th of february 2025 the S&P 500 reached an intraday high of 6134,50 points. From then onwards the index mostly went downwards, reaching a low on the 7th of april 2025 of 4835,04 points. It then passed those 6134,50 points on the 27th of june 2025, and it hasn't fallen below this threshold since. Your 'Bear market' lasted 4 months and 7 days.
2. When looking at the most extreme intraday highs and lows the S&P did indeed drop 21,16%. However when deciding if something is a bear market, S&P Dow Jones Indices, solely measures on the basis of official daily closing prices. Based on these closing prices, the maximum fall at the time stood at just under 19% -> No bear market.
3. Even if you ignore both factors in my previous two points, the S&P 500 finished 2025 with a 16,9% performance. This neglects any bear market shouts, as it solidifies the fact that the market experienced a short (flash) crash.
1. On the 20th of february 2025 the S&P 500 reached an intraday high of 6134,50 points. From then onwards the index mostly went downwards, reaching a low on the 7th of april 2025 of 4835,04 points. It then passed those 6134,50 points on the 27th of june 2025, and it hasn't fallen below this threshold since. Your 'Bear market' lasted 4 months and 7 days.
2. When looking at the most extreme intraday highs and lows the S&P did indeed drop 21,16%. However when deciding if something is a bear market, S&P Dow Jones Indices, solely measures on the basis of official daily closing prices. Based on these closing prices, the maximum fall at the time stood at just under 19% -> No bear market.
3. Even if you ignore both factors in my previous two points, the S&P 500 finished 2025 with a 16,9% performance. This neglects any bear market shouts, as it solidifies the fact that the market experienced a short (flash) crash.
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@BasicallyGambling
Fair enough, if you look strictly at the S&P 500 index in USD, the recovery was indeed much faster by late June.
I acknowledge that the USD index timeline was shorter than I initially stated.
However, technically speaking we are European investors… so as you from the Netherlands if i'm correct.... a bear market is defined by a peak-to-trough drop of 20% or more, which we both agree happened between February (6,134) and April (4,835) with a ~21% drawdown.
So the definition itself stands correct?...
More importantly, looking strictly at the USD index ignores the reality for EUR-based investors and UCITS ETFs (like IUSA or EUR-denominated assets).
Because the USD depreciated against the EUR during the market recovery, the currency loss acted as a heavy drag.
For a European investor, the portfolio didn't fully recover in local purchasing power by June it took several months longer to break even in EUR terms.
So while the USD index had a sharp V-shaped rebound, in real EUR terms the impact of that bear market was both real and much longer-lasting.
Fair enough, if you look strictly at the S&P 500 index in USD, the recovery was indeed much faster by late June.
I acknowledge that the USD index timeline was shorter than I initially stated.
However, technically speaking we are European investors… so as you from the Netherlands if i'm correct.... a bear market is defined by a peak-to-trough drop of 20% or more, which we both agree happened between February (6,134) and April (4,835) with a ~21% drawdown.
So the definition itself stands correct?...
More importantly, looking strictly at the USD index ignores the reality for EUR-based investors and UCITS ETFs (like IUSA or EUR-denominated assets).
Because the USD depreciated against the EUR during the market recovery, the currency loss acted as a heavy drag.
For a European investor, the portfolio didn't fully recover in local purchasing power by June it took several months longer to break even in EUR terms.
So while the USD index had a sharp V-shaped rebound, in real EUR terms the impact of that bear market was both real and much longer-lasting.
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