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Sina · 2025-03-27T13:03:41.735254Z

At the risk of polarizing this article... 30% capital gains tax? No tax exemption for crypto? (Will gold follow?) Significant increase in the income tax rate? Speculation tax on real estate? I'm flying to Dubai on Sunday and will be looking at real estate there at the beginning of the week. I don't know whether I'll actually make the move. Unlike in other professions, as a lawyer it's not so easy to just carry on working there. After all, my current employer is also based in Dubai... But maybe I'll do something completely different, who knows. At least I'm not at the moment... so I'm now looking at the possibilities.

BM@Bmahone

3D

I'm going to Switzerland in August 🇨🇭 I've already got a job there and everything is under wraps away from Germany 🙌

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Cekay@CMustermann

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@Bmahone Nice. If you ever find the time, I would find an experience report on this very helpful. We are currently planning the same thing.

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BM@Bmahone

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@CMustermann
I drove down depending on which canton you want to move to. There are these places, so I went to Zurich, for example. You need a b or c residence permit, but you can usually get a B permit and then you can stay in Switzerland for three months. I took a hotel room there for that long and went looking for a job. But you also have to be able to prove that you have enough money in your pocket. Ideally, of course, you should have found a direct job so that you can get this certificate straight away because otherwise it's a bit of an obstacle or, as I said, you have enough money so that you don't have to live on anyone's pocket. Between 2000 or 3000 Fr. would be optimal, above that of course everything would be considerably better then you would have fewer problems. But if you can show everything, you have money, you have a job.

Then, logically, you also have to take care of health insurance, which you also have to take out. Provided you have found an apartment and a job. You have up to three months to do this.

Of course you also have to inform the authorities of this here are the receipts I am insured.

Of course you also have to register for tax purposes that you are now living permanently in Switzerland.

Either you take the radical step of moving to Switzerland completely before you give up everything in Germany, in which case you will of course be subject to double taxation under the double tax agreement, but if you give up everything in the country then you will only be fully resident in Switzerland.

Once the three months are up, you have to extend this with the residence permit and prove that you still have the apartment, the job and so on. B or L where L is even valid for five years. And of course you have to bring these normal papers with you, I'm going to say proof of employment, i.e. your contract, your personal details, i.e. your passport etc., the residence permit and so on and so forth, so it starts all over again and then you have a few years of peace and quiet for the time being

And if everything has worked out by then, you can apply for a C permit, which means permanent, but you must have lived and worked in Switzerland for the whole five years. And if that all works out, you can then apply for citizenship, which also takes years, but since you're as good as integrated with a C anyway, it doesn't matter at some point you'll have your I'm calling this my Swiss passport in quotation marks that you're 100% Swiss 😄😄 it's very annoying but it's definitely worth it

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Filou@federalreserve

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Very cool, as a Swiss I am happy about Germans moving to Switzerland 🤝🏻 hope you can already spend August 1st in Switzerland. (Highest national holiday) 🍾🥳

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BM@Bmahone

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@federalreserve Yes, I'm already looking forward to it 😌the next thing I just have to take care of now is somehow a depot, so I have to look for good alternatives to Trade Republic and so on, then I could finally have Lindt in my depot 😄

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Filou@federalreserve

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@Bmahone Swissquote is very good. Yuh should also be good. Saxo is a newcomer that is being talked about a lot. Pillar 3a is important, you are welcome to find out more. If you choose frankly, I also have a code 😂🙏🏻

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BM@Bmahone

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@federalreserve I actually already have swissquote, but I've only ever used it as an account to store euros in francs for exchange😂 To be honest, I've never really looked into the fact that you can also do stocks and things like that there, apart from the prices. I've only ever used it as an account

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Luna@PippiLangstrumpf

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@BM welcome then. I'm with Neon, simply because I already had an account there. Swissquote and Yuh are equivalent in terms of costs. Swissquote probably has the biggest offer.

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Cekay@CMustermann

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@Bmahone Thank you. I would apply from Germany for jobs in Switzerland at larger companies.

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BM@Bmahone

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@CMustermann That's great😃😃

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DoeJohnOne@DoeJohnOne

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Then you can look forward to 35% capital gains tax at 🇨🇭
Don't want to open a can of worms here with the cost of living etc...

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Ver todas las 9 respuestas adicionales

Play R.@Playrio

3D

I think it's good when people who are dissatisfied take action and don't just complain. So all the best. Personally, I am happy and grateful to be able to live in Germany. Dubai would be the last place I would want to live. But everyone is different and everyone has a different view of things.

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Sina@lawinvest

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@Playrio Dubai is not uncritical in some respects. But I also booked a ticket to Miami on Thursday. Admittedly, it's a limited Difficult flight time from Dubai, but at least it's a direct flight. But the USA are not entirely uncritical, at least at the moment 😅 I don't have to rush into anything. I'll take a look at them first

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Fabre@Fabre

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You are welcome to come to Switzerland! The left-wing economic and unworldly politicians in your country still haven't understood. They're all just greedy for power. Dr. Clown Merz is now also on the left and has sold his soul for power! If I were German, I would emigrate immediately.

The last one turns out the lights in Berlin

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Cekay@CMustermann

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@Fabre please put in a good word for us 👉🏻👈🏻

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McZed@McZed

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@Fabre Merz did not get 50%+ so that he could govern alone. This has nothing to do with the fact that he is "left-wing". He has to find compromises with the SPD. Just like any other party would have to, unless it has an absolute majority. Even in Switzerland.

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Fabre@Fabre

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But in Switzerland we don't build brown walls. Elected by the people means in government! We do not exclude any parties! Afd=svp! Everyone must be considered, left and right! AFD is 20% of the people's vote and will be ignored. It doesn't work like that and Merz's clown has to go against the left! And such a vote belongs before the people! A federal parliament must not decide something like this with false election promises! You have no direct democracy! A candidate can lie at the election like Merz and then change direction! In Switzerland, votes go before the people!

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Jonas@Schnurze

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@Fabre Now I don't know the SVP well enough, but the AFD lacks the simplest basics. They can't even read properly and spread unfiltered false statements (perhaps deliberately). Almost like Merz, only 10 times worse. They should be involved in the government?

Imagine governing was a soccer match. Everyone (more or less) sticks to the rules, only the AFD thinks it has to play a hand game all the time. Would you include the AFD in your team? Then you'd be constantly outnumbered 😀

The people who vote AFD haven't studied the party and/or want to get rid of their personal frustration.

I also think the politicians up there are out of touch and that they are only thinking about their own welfare/enriching themselves. But the AfD is 1:1 the same, only stupid and antisocial. If you're against the system, then you should just vote for the Animal Protection Party or something. But sorry, the AFD is not an alternative!

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Horrax D@Horrax

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@Schnurze Everything you say is theory. There are umpteen examples where you can say the same against every single other party in the Bundestag. AFD garbage or not. It can hardly get any worse than the current one. If the party is so stupid, do you want to wait until it gets 50%? I really don't know what people are thinking... And as the previous speaker said, an election is an election. You either do democracy or you don't. It really is that simple.

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Jonas@Schnurze

17H

@Horrax It could get a lot worse than the previous governments. The Nazis were also elected back then. Was that a good thing? Should we make the same mistake now?

Besides, the AfD is in the Bundestag. So why isn't that a democracy? If the AfD's content is not even remotely compatible with any other party, coalition negotiations simply don't make sense. 20% of people like the content, but 80% - i.e. by far the majority - don't! That's democracy ;)

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LarryLindt@LarryLindt

6H

Calling the CDU left-wing is absolutely wild 😂😵‍💫😂😵‍💫

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BritishNick@BritishNick

3D

I worked there for 4 years. I enjoyed the access to other parts of the world but found Dubai to be draining. You have to close your eyes to the way people are treated, that it’s an economy that trades on low wages and no social protections.

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Miki@MikiChiu

2D

@BritishNick some lawyers are more than fine with exploitation, I'm pretty sure Amazon 's lawyers sleep tight at night

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Cekay@CMustermann

3D

And another top taxpayer is leaving the country. Well done SPD!

We'll start scouting locations in Switzerland in the summer, and when I finish my MBA next year, we'll start actively looking.

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Tobi@Tobiwankenobi500

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Hi @lawinvest - please keep us up to date :)

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Stephan@Boergieking

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I keep reading here that it's better or better elsewhere than in Germany...I'm not always sure to be honest.

Certainly not everything is perfect in Germany, but these blind spots will also exist in Switzerland and certainly in Dubai.

I know a Swiss man who moved to Germany for love. He is not a wealthy person, he trained as an electronics technician. He earns almost 30% less here than in Switzerland, but according to him, he can afford more from his net salary here in Germany than he used to in Switzerland.

I would therefore be interested to hear the experiences of people who took this step 2-3 years ago.

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Stefan@Da_Fischi

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@Boergieking We moved to Spain 8 years ago and, weighing up all the pros and cons, we are better off here than in Germany. However, someone else may come to a different conclusion based on what we have defined as quality of life.

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Stephan@Boergieking

2D

Yes, that's exactly what I mean. Why always Switzerland and Dubai and not the Netherlands, Austria, Luxembourg, Belgium, etc.? Of course, this depends on many personal factors, but to attribute a move solely to taxes and to say that I have more net income here or there is too one-sided. You need to clarify your entire life up to the question of what you will do in old age.

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Louis@Dellou

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I always don't understand how people can emigrate so easily... Don't you have any friends?

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Tobi@Tobiwankenobi500

3D

@Dellou Real friends are always there :)

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Imvestment4Life@Investment4Life

3D

@Dellou I, for example, find friends very easily. Could live anywhere. In fact, many childhood friends live all over the world. No matter where and when I go on vacation, you always see each other and you always stay in touch via Whatsapp/Imstagram.

If the tax burden is increased in Austria, I will also move out with my €150,000 salary!

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Mister_ultra@Mister_ultra

3D

@Dellou For me, this is also the absolutely decisive reason. Family and friends all live in the same district. None of my closest friends have really moved more than a few kilometers away.

I would emigrate in a heartbeat, but family and friends definitely keep me here.

So the state can exploit me further and further...

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Uwe@SchlaubiSchlumpf

3D

@Dellou I don't understand that either. Of course you keep in touch. But I sometimes suffer from the fact that I've moved 200km away from my friends and family. How do you do it when you have several thousand?

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Sina@lawinvest

3D

@Dellou I totally understand you, but if you come from a region in Germany that you left behind to study (a few contacts are still there), studied in Berlin - at turbo speed, so hardly any time for contacts - and then work 60-80 hours a week in a law firm in HH, then there's not much time for connections. By the way, an interesting consideration to change that as soon as possible

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Ralf@edihose

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@Dellou Your friend is money 💰

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MO@Oppiwahn

3D

But even many, some of them moved away years ago, my friends are spread all over the world. By that I mean people who have accompanied me through life for decades. I'd rather have a few good friends than lots of superficial ones. As you get older, your priorities change.

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Dan@fizzelfritz

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I'm starting work in Thailand in 5 days... I'm looking forward to it. Good luck with your apartment search 🏙️

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user6a41fe783ab44@user6a41fe783ab44

3D

Cash about human rights 🤡

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LarryLindt@LarryLindt

6H

@user6a41fe783ab44 Cash via drainage system

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Ph1l1pp@Ph1l1pp

4H

@user6a41fe783ab44 Migration over the security of your own population 🤡

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trade_whisperer_1842@trade_whisperer_1842

2D

I can understand anyone who wants to emigrate.
I'll stay here and ride it out.
Our inn is over 800 years old and has been in the family for over 100 years. Our business has survived 2 world wars, the 30-year war, Napoleon and the Habsburgs.
Now we will also survive the Merz!
We are from the Black Forest and I would never leave our home.
Traditions are important to us.
Governments come and go, our homeland remains.
I can't think of a nicer place in the world where our children would be better off than here in the Black Forest.
Of course with millions in the bank account in elite circles.....
I respect everyone who pulls it off.
Good luck to you!!!
We are holding our ground here and hope that we can once again say with pride:
I am happy to be German.

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mami_goes_boerse@mami_goes_boerse

3D

Personally, I'm not the biggest Dubai fan. I like it for a vacation, but not to live there. But of course I wish you all the best 🍀

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Heisterkamp@Ernie3486

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@mami_goes_boerse Your Vanguard sweater has arrived yet?🤔because mine hasn't

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mami_goes_boerse@mami_goes_boerse

3D

@Ernie3486 Not yet 🤷‍♀️

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Doja@Doja

3D

I'm from Italy and (currently) couldn't imagine emigrating, but when I look at your situation in DE I can understand it. Dubai wouldn't be an option for me because it just doesn't seem authentic. I really see more opportunities and quality of life in Switzerland, parts of the USA or Singapore.

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Soprano@Soprano

3D

As a lawyer, emigrating is of course particularly challenging. More or less serious depending on your specialty, but basically you will be much more familiar with the laws of your home country than with any other. Certain professions, such as police officers, teachers and all administrative professions, are generally much more difficult to emigrate than, for example, skilled trades.

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Stefan@Da_Fischi

3D

Good luck in Dubai! In my circle of friends, all of them (3) came back after 2-3 years. The main criticism was a very restricted life and little freedom if you are not Muslim and a lot of boredom if you don't want to belong to the superficial consumer society. On the other hand, they came back with a lot of savings and were able to use them to buy property that they would otherwise probably have had to pay off until they retired.

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Sina@lawinvest

3D

@Da_Fischi thank you for the impressions :)

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The W.@thewolfofallstreetz

3D

Good luck! Oman (Muscat) is also very interesting for the winter months. Great hospitality, great weather, good food, growing foreign community, etc.

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Dan@fizzelfritz

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@thewolfofallstreetz Oman is great. I like it much better than Dubai (from a vacation perspective)

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aminemeskni@Aminmeskini

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@thewolfofallstreetz I can confirm that, I lived there myself for 13 years

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Ale@The-Italian-investor

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Just remember that money is a tool to live the life you like. Choose how, with whom and where you want to live and only after that think about the tax and money part

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Dividendensammler@DividendensammIer

3D

Why polarized? DE is close to the end. Anyone who still justifies what's going on here is beyond help and completely deluded

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Jonas@Schnurze

2D

Highly polarizing and crying at a very high level 😀

With the exception of the capital gains tax, I find the proposals understandable.

Why should crypto be tax-free when shares are not? Both or not at all

3% higher income tax rate for the richest, i.e. those who already have enough (but abolition of the solidarity surcharge), where is the significant difference? And where is the problem?

Why should real estate gains be tax-free?

The wealth tax on assets over €100 million is still missing, as a considerable burden for the people in DE 😀

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Ver todas las 2 respuestas adicionales

Ralf@edihose

3D

I'm going to the pub later, let's see if the beer still tastes good. The little man's sunshine, getting stoned and drunk 😉🍻

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Leonardo@ModernMoney

2D

I don't understand why a few percent higher taxes should be a reason for a wealthy person to emigrate to Dubai. Due to the returns achieved in all these asset classes, your wealth will still continue to grow, just a little more slowly.
With growing inequality, the idea of higher taxation is understandable. However, in my opinion, there should be a progressive model that only takes effect from a certain level of wealth.
Inequality destabilizes our society and everyone should want to do something about it. Stability, legal certainty and physical security also benefit people with large fortunes. In a country like Dubai, a new ruler can quickly come to power who is perhaps not so foreigner-friendly and then you can quickly lose your assets there (keyword: legal security).
But wanting to start a new chapter abroad for professional or cultural reasons can also help you personally. I think taxes as the main reason is too short-sighted.

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Name@user24790529394

3D

As far as I know, your deposit has 8 digits? So working should be more of a fun event and you can live "somewhere".

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John@Transporter

3D

I can absolutely understand that. My children will grow up here and as soon as they are on their own two feet, we'll say goodbye and leave Germany for the Philippines....

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CD@Carpe-Diem

3D

Well, one tax in Germany is more than in Austria. KESt in Austria is 27.5%. Is that really the case? Hopefully it won't be increased.

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SatsStacker@SatsStacker

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Voting with your feet is absolutely legitimate.

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Martin E.@MoneyMartin

3D

You'll love it! Highly recommended. Have fun and be sure to check out the Bulgari Resort for dinner. :)

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German1@German1

3D

You're doing it right!

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Myd@myd

3D

Good luck 👍

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MO@Oppiwahn

3D

Yep, understandable. I'm also looking around, out of Europe, Switzerland as an alternative. Costa Rica, Uriguay, Paraguay are not on many people's radar. Many Europeans are there, Germans are welcome. Safe countries with sometimes better infrastructure than Germany, moderate to low taxes and good to very good healthcare. Also climatically balanced.

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TaxesAreTheft@TaxesAreTheft

2D

Hi Sina, I can highly recommend Singapore. I have friends there and who knows maybe my shares will be there in 1-2 years.

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Flight booked...